Add user maintenance message next to downloads

Shall we add a note/link next to the ISO downloads to advise new users whether or not Manjaro is the right distribution for them, and a link to the maintenance page in the wiki?

This would solve so many problems with users not maintaining pacnews, orphans, etc.

No.

Would you read it?

Act upon it?

…it would solve zero “problems”

In my opinion.

grafik

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I tend to agree that it would solve nothing.

Quite the opposite - it would be seen as elitist - I don’t about you - that words has a bad ring to it - something like better than the rest of us.

Perhaps this topic is better in the Member Hub?

The topic you mention is a great essay - and it works in the forum - because, here we are all equal - I don’t think it will work well on a company website - which for all intents and purpose - that is what manjaro.org is.

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I’ve done the honours on this occasion, if you deem it appropriate. :wink:

I agree there should be links referring to maintenance, but how and where is not going to be the easiest decision.

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Nah, there’s no need to move it there, although I appreciate your concern. :+1:

Thank you, thank you. :man_bowing: :man_bowing: :man_bowing:

:stuck_out_tongue:

As the author of that essay, I agree with you that it would not be a good idea to have it up there in the Download section of the Manjaro website — as you say, it was written specifically for the forum.

At the same time, I also do agree with @yoel that there should be a stronger emphasis on the fact that Manjaro isn’t for everyone, and that it is definitely not a suitable distribution for an absolute newcomer to GNU/Linux, and especially not if said absolute newcomer comes straight from the Microsoft ecosystem.

In terms of operating system design, GNU/Linux and Microsoft Windows couldn’t possibly be farther removed from one another.

  • The former is an operating system that runs equally well on mainframes and supercomputers as it does on laptops and notebooks, or even devices smaller than that.

  • The latter is an operating system that started out as merely a graphical user interface on top of a single-tasking, non-networked, single-user operating system — i.e. MS-DOS/PC-DOS — and that was then later enhanced by way of a DOS memory extender and a cooperative multitasking scheduler. And then later still, that whole lot was essentially ported over onto a more powerful but design-wise actually incompatible kernel called NT, with as their primary directive — from Bill Gates himself — that the end result was not allowed to break compatibility at the API level.

By consequence, someone habituated to the Microsoft way of, not just working with a computer, but also how they perceive a computer and how a computer should behave, will have a much harder time getting to know and understand GNU/Linux than someone who has never even seen a computer from up close in their entire life.

And that leads to trouble. Many if not most of the problems we see being reported here at the forum are a direct result of what I call “the Microsoft indoctrination”. As such, a heads-up in one way or another for people coming from the MS-Windows world without any prior experience at all with GNU/Linux — or with another UNIX, like FreeBSD/NetBSD and siblings — is warranted.

But in my personal opinion, this should then be carefully embedded into the description of the Manjaro distribution on the main manjaro.org web page, not via a link to my (technically more elaborate) essay here at the forum.

In the past, we’ve had text up there that wrongfully depicted Manjaro as an ideal distribution for absolute beginners and for gamers, neither of which is even remotely true.

Yes, Manjaro is more user-friendly than Arch proper, and yes, you can play games on Manjaro, and we even offer — via our hardware partners — a dedicated Manjaro gaming console.

However, as a general-purpose UNIX platform that you can download and install yourself, Manjaro is neither aimed at beginners nor at gamers, and if we’re going to keep insisting that it would be, then we’re also going to keep on being reminded of how it’s not true, both because of the increase in threads from people who have no idea what they’ve gotten themselves into, and because of feedback from people who will be more vocal about our perceived claims of Manjaro’s user-friendliness toward newbies.

The current introduction page at manjaro.org is already immensely better than what used to be there before, but in my personal opinion — shared by many among you, I’m sure — the technical and advanced nature of Manjaro as a distribution could still be emphasized more clearly.

Just my €0.02… :man_shrugging:

6 Likes

±R0.40 in South Africa. And here’s mine:

I don’t think this will make such a big difference. The reason being relatively simple, and unfortunately not something that anyone other than oneself can change oneself:

An attitude of self-righteousness, entitlement and attitude.

How can it be fixed? Well, it starts with the parents…

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Are you saying that I am self-righteous, entitled, and wielding an attitude? :confused:

Yes. We all have an attitude. That’s a fact. Whether it’s an attitude of humbleness, entitlement, or know-all is up to each and every one off us.

Nope. The problem is that.

You have a lifetime’s experience with GNU/Linux. I’m surprised you don’t have a bad attitude.

But I’ll reword it:

not something that anyone other than oneself can change oneself

Better?

Not in the sense of how the expression “having an attitude” is commonly understood in the English language. The expression “having an attitude” implies a bad attitude.

Yes, much better, thank you.

I know. :wink:

It’s one of the stupider things in the English language. Well, Afrikaans as well, so I’m guessing it’s not the language, but the speakers. :wink:

You’re welcome!

The goal we have with Manjaro Immutable to provide a version that will actually be usable by absolute beginners.

That means primarily no AUR, no updates through pacman (including no pacnew etc).

Currently Manjaro Immutable is out in a community testing release. Once we have this version ready for everybody, it’ll be added to the manjaro.org website. And then it would definitely make sense to describe the versions a bit with a new user “warning” for the regular Manjaro version.

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Agreed; on both counts.

Instead of a link to that article, as @yoel suggests, a valid compromise might be to add a brief recommendation for new users to join the Manjaro Forum; and provide a general link (optional).

Is there an official name for it yet?

I mean, “…for Dummies” probably isn’t available; and likely not overly appropriate. Something to compliment Edge would be nice.

Manjaro Static?
Manjaro boring?

I meant to use that as an example, not a suggestion to use that specific article. Although I admit, it may have appeared that way to some.

What bothers me is seeing users who were clueless about basic maintenance and panic when they end up booting to a black screen, and then tell us no one was there to tell them :man_shrugging:.

Anyhow, as @romangg mentioned, let’s at least see how Manjaro Immutable rolls out.

1 Like

The best minds of a popular office suite could only come up with OpenOffice Still for the LTS version…

What grinds me is the thought that Manjaro might settle for something equally unimaginative, or that it remains as Manjaro Immutable, which will mean nothing to potential users.

It’s a marketing consideration.

Edge… which is what Unstable/Stable(ish) will morph into, is great for its purpose… and it’s been used before in different situations; it’s recognisable for what it is – Living on the edge! (yay).

Immutable means nothing to anyone who hasn’t completed a Computer Science course of some kind.

I’m not saying it’s easy. As I type, I can’t think of a perfect name, either; perhaps Intepid or Valiant, which loosely mean the same as Immutable; or, even Manjaro Balance (not on the Edge).

These are random ideas. I’m certain some serious thought could produce something more workable from every perspective.

Edge sounds like microsoft has a browser spying in there somewhere.

2 Likes

I know. I know! I know!!!

Let’s go with the poplar trend now and

name it

Manjaro-ng

I’ll let myself out.

Or even better!

Combine it with @soundofthunder’s edge suggestion, and

make it

Manjaro-nG

Now with more edge.

For the lords of Edge!

immutojaro

1 Like

No, no you don’t, not yet!

Bear witness to this obscurity...

Manjaro T-OS… :vulcan_salute:

Oh, you’re sharp today.

Edge is the likely name that the Unstable repo will be renamed to, apparently; so, the rolling-release would become Manjaro Edge.