Multi-boot Manjaro + Kubuntu on second disk, separate from Windows 11 disk

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I have got a new (refurbished) T480 with a 1TB NVME Samsung drive. I have installed in the WWAN slot a 512GB NVME WD drive.

On the Samsung drive is Windows 11 pre-installed. On the WD drive, I have tried multiple times installing (i) Kubuntu, then (ii) Manjaro, with partitions for home and swap. With the warnings coming up during installation, I now have a 640MB FAT32 partition, where I would target /boot/efi .

I can install Kubuntu first, that works. I then install Manjaro KDE, that works. At that point, Kubuntu stops working, I think because I’m overwriting the /boot/efi .

I have now tried (i) installing Kubuntu, (ii) installing Refind, and (iii) installing Manjaro without specifying the /boot/efi. Manjaro won’t boot.

I then tried (i) installing Kubuntu, (ii) installing Manjaro, (iii) installing Refind. Manjaro works, but Kubuntu doesn’t. Strangely enough, it slowly finds its way to the login screen, but entering password leads to a black screen that hangs.

On my X230T, I have a similar configuration with Windows on the main 2TB drive, and Manjaro and Kubuntu on the WWAN drive. This was done 10 years ago, and recently refreshed with the Windows drive upgraded.

I’m now thinking of reverting back from GPT to MBR, and working around efi, if I can. I thought that Refind might resolve the issue, but my guess is that it finds /boot/efi for Manjaro, but not having a /boot/efi for Kubuntu is causing an issue.

I’ve also been reading about the possitibility of having TWO efi partitions (i.e. one for Manjaro, and one for Kubuntu, but I don’t know if that will or won’t resolve things. I’ve already done re-installations at least 8 times, so I’m willing to experiment … but I’m getting tired of this!

Does anyone have similar experiences with multi-boot on Manjaro and Ubuntu under GPT and efi, without having to worry about Windows?

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What I notice from your post is that you seem to be consistently overwriting your $ESP.

Let’s presume that Ubuntu has been installed correctly.

When you proceed to install Manjaro, use the manual partitioning method. Now, the $ESP should have already been created by your Ubuntu install – this should be re-used by the Manjaro install – but, here’s the important factor: do not format the $ESP – all you need do is assign the mountpoint (usually /boot/efi) and set the appropriate flags.

Then continue to create (and format) whatever other partitions you might desire (swap, /, /home, for example).

Aside:- I have found this type of multiboot configuration is not inherently stable. The safest is to install only one OS per disk, and avoid possible complication when using multiple Grub instances.

That said, using rEFInd to effectively chain load each Grub instance can potentially overcome some difficulties; in rare cases, installing rEFInd to the fallback location can also be advantageous.

I hope this is helpful.

Regards.

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Got no experience with kubuntu & majaro on one disk but I recently got a new pc with windows preinstalled. So now I have windows on one disk & manjaro on another. Before installing manajro I set that disk to boot first in the bios. Grub picked up windows & it’s all running great. Sounds like maybe if you can set the manjaro disk to boot first, install manjaro then install kubuntu without installing kubuntu’s boot it should work. Manjaro will pickup ubuntu & add it to grub. (have heard that manjaro likes its own grub better) When I did this I did not have to play around with any bios settings other than the boot order.
After saying all that I maybe wrong. At least with the kubuntu bit.

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Thanks for that suggestion about not formatting the ESP @soundofthunder .

In the hour that has passed, I’ve tried another experiment. I’ve created two ESPs.

I installed Kubuntu with ESP2. That went as normal.

I then installed Manjaro KDE with ESP1. That’s fine, and I get the usual Grub menu.

From Grub, then selecting to book Kubuntu … there’s a slow delay, and then I’m in emergency mode.

I’m begining to wonder if it’s something about Kubuntu 24.04 .

Windows deserves to be on its own physical disk, and I don’t want to mess that up. However, the reason for multiple Linux distros on a second disk is redundancy. I have had Manjaro not start properly, and then used Kubuntu to clean things up to make it bootable again. This doesn’t happen frequently, but has been a lifesaver in a hotel across the ocean, the day before a presentation!

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Thanks for the response @Hipster . The reason for multiple distros is redundancy. On an X230, I have a friend who was teaching in China, and we didn’t get together very often. She would have one distro fail, boot into another, and continue. The longest stretch has been 2 years between visits, at which point, a reinstall was faster than diagnosing.

The difference between a 2012-era X230 and a 2019-era T480 is the move from SATA disks to NVME. I’ve been formatting as GPT, but wonder if I have to go back to MBR.

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A good strategy.

The best is to have every OS on its own disk, though I concede that’s not always the most cost-effective way to handle multiboot; and it’s not always practical when using a Laptop.

The $ESP is capable of hosting multiple UEFI bootloaders by design. Having multiple $ESPs is not ideal, either, though some seem to adopt this approach out of desperation.

If redundancy is the main concern here, may I suggest a strategy I use personally…

I keep several OS installed to separate SSDs. I also use an internal caddy mounting. This allows me to boot an OS only when its needed, simply by inserting it into a caddy. As each OS is kept on a separate SSD, there is never any complication such as you’re experiencing.

I keep BSD, Debian, Manjaro and Windows separated in this way, and have for many years. Manjaro is the Main OS in my case, which remains installed normally (without a caddy) and I have rEFInd installed on the Manjaro $ESP in the fallback location ($ESP/BOOT) which is also selected as default in UEFI boot order.

Secure Boot is also worth mentioning – Manjaro does not support Secure Boot even though some other Linux distributions might. To successfully multiboot Windows and Manjaro Secure Boot must be disabled in BIOS.

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I wouldn’t bother with MBR. This machine is being run in Legacy mode, but with GPT and the small bios_grub reserved space; all newly prepared disks are GPT in my case regardless of what the OS uses for its boot.

As far as getting things up and running quickly, I like the idea of two distros. But IMHO it’s a good idea to always have a Live USB on hand, with a recent (preferably the latest) .ISO(s) on. Ventoy is good for that, as you can keep a collection of .ISOs and boot from whichever you choose.

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Thanks for all of the comments. I think I’m going to give up, and go with a single OS on the second drive.

I just tried installing Debian 12 KDE , and then Manjaro. Manjaro is fine. Grub into Debian goes to emergency mode.

The Live USB is something that I’ve always had on hand, in my work knapsack.

I’m going to repartition the disk one last time. It will be Windows 11 on the ITB drive, and Manjaro on the 512GB drive.

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That being the case, perhaps the following article might be useful as a general guide:

Regards.

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I don’t know if or what differences there are between the version of GRUB and its configuration files between Manjaro (and I guess pure Arch) and those used in a current Debian installation.

Maybe this is something worth considering, although I’d generally “expect GRUB to just work”.

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EFI and MBR is incompatible.

Having a Windows system and a Linux system on separate disks - that I can understand.

Having 2 Linux systems - that I don’t understand.

Just because you can does not imply that you should.

I think your problem is that Manjaro and Ubuntu uses different versions of grub - of course I cannot be sure. I loathe dualboot - Linux has primary system and if required another os for test or troubleshooting - spin up a virtual machine.

If your goal is to use grub as selector between the three operating systems - you are going to have problems.

My suggestion to avoid issues is: Disable grub os-prober - and use F12 boot either Microsoft efi, Ubuntu efi or Manjaro efi.

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I always use the following configuration: UEFI, ubuntu, manjaro, and windows. For more than 10 years. While switching machines and disks. EFI is common. Do not overwrite EFI!!

Use manjaro for the primary grub (if you don’t want to use your brain, this is a must). According to my research, it is difficult to boot arch-based systems with ubuntu-based grub. It was difficult.

(I rewrite grub.cfg with a script. Not recommended)

In reality, I’m used to being able to fix grub’s black screen even with both eyes closed. It takes about 3 minutes. This is my life’s work. (lol) It seems to be a not recommended action these days. For that reason, I don’t recommend it.

I think so.
Anyone can do it. This is the easy way.

For asus, select the boot device with F8.

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I appreciatte the enthusiasm on continued responses!

Toe be clear, on a Thinkpad X230T, I have two disks. The primary disk is Windows. The secondary disk, formatted MBR, has Manjaro and Ubuntu successfully in multiboot. It’s been that way for 10 years.

On this new (refurbished) T480, I now have only two operating systems. Windows 11 on the shipped primary disk. Manjaro on the WWAN slot disk formatted GPT. This is where I gave up, and will use a LiveUSB when I need one.

I also have a T15g that came with Windows 10, now upgraded to Windows 11. The second drive is a SATA SSD. I had installed Ubuntu and Manjaro on it. I now notice that it’s formatted GPT … and attempting to boot into Ubuntu leads to an emergency mode. I was trying to Wayland working with an Nvidia GPU working, and had to use the LiveUSB to recover. Someday, I will remove the partition set up for Ubuntu, either into the Manjaro partition, or for home.

My finding to date (and I’m willing to be corrected on this) is that it’s not possible to have Manjaro and Ubuntu on the same physical disk under GPT formatting. It is possible to have Manjaro and Ubuntu on the same physical disk under MBR formatting.

I can use the Boot disk selector (F12 on a Thinkpad) to choose whether the primary or secondary physical disk is tried first. Grub on the second disk recognizes Windows on the first disk, so I don’t have to use the F12 key very often.

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It seems very strange.

On my PCs, ubuntu, windows and manjaro coexist on the same disk, and I can select them in grub and boot normally.

It’s a very natural part of everyday life.

Maybe I’ve missed something in your post. It may be the right answer for your environment.

But even so, it seems very strange again.

It is possible to have Manjaro and Ubuntu on the same physical disk under GPT formatting.

again,
I’m not being sarcastic. I just can’t express myself well, so please forgive me.
Use manjaro for the primary grub (if you don’t want to use your brain, this is a must).

15

Consider yourself corrected.

It certainly is possible to have both Manjaro and Ubuntu on the same disk, sharing the same $ESP – and here’s the “but” – but, this scenario is typically unstable longterm and often requires ongoing caution and maintenance.

This general procedure involves installing the rEFInd UEFI Bootloader in addition to Grub that is supplied by each OS.

Prerequisites

Temporarily disconnect (unplug) the Windows disk - this will be reconnected much later. :eyes:

  • Secure Boot – Manjaro does not support the Microsoft implementation of Secure Boot, therefore it must be disabled in BIOS.
  • Windows Fast Startup – This hibernation variant should be disabled in Windows.
  • If your mainboard is equipped with a Fast Boot option, this is recommended to be disabled.

For both Manjaro and Ubuntu, each OS must:

  • be installed using UEFI; the USB should be prepared using a GPT partitioning scheme, and the installer media must boot as UEFI.
  • be installed using a GPT partitioning scheme and boot as UEFI.

The $ESP

After installing Ubuntu;
re-using the $ESP but not formatting it during Manjaro install;

the following will be the general layout of the $ESP, and will contain the UEFI boot files of both Manjaro and Ubuntu.

$ESP
└─ EFI
    ├─ boot
    ├─ manjaro
    └─ ubuntu

With both Ubuntu and Manjaro installed, boot into Manjaro, and then refind needs to be installed. First rEFInd needs to be made available to Manjaro and then installed to the $ESP:

1. Install rEFInd from the official Manjaro repo

sudo pacman -S refind

2. Use rEFInd’s own tool to setup the ESP directory

sudo refind-install

3. At this point you can shutdown and reconnect your Windows disk. :eyes:

4. Boot to the UEFI BIOS and make sure that rEFInd UEFI Bootloader is configured as first in boot order.

$ESP
└─ EFI
    ├─ boot
    ├─ manjaro
    ├─ ubuntu
    └─ refind

Your default bootloader should now be refind and should automatically detect and display icons for;

  • Manjaro (Grub2; in $ESP/EFI/manjaro)
  • Manjaro (Kernel stub; bypasses Grub)
  • Ubuntu (Grub2; in $ESP/EFI/ubuntu)
  • Ubuntu (Kernel stub; bypasses Grub)
  • Windows (detected on Windows disk)

Naturally, the process is much more involved than this simple overview, and there are decisions to be made along the way. As long as clumsy mistakes in judgement are avoided, this scenario is indeed possible.

Having said that, I still maintain that the safest scenario is to have only one OS on each disk; within the limitations of the hardware available to work with. :eyes:

Regards.

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