Manjaro Cinnamon 21.1.2 shipping Vivaldi browser

At least we can be sure that this group is loud :grinning: It’s interesting also how many of them back to windows because “my games don’t work on linux”.

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If the dev would have experimented with other fully open-source browsers this kind of reaction would have not happened. It would still have been an inferior choice to Firefox but still calming for us privacy minded folks.

TL;DR

I switched to Linux because I didn’t want to pay >100€ to get an English version of Windows.

The long version:

I deleted Windows in 2012 because I was given a new laptop in lieu of payment for a project and Windows 7 came pre-installed in 2 languages I didn’t want so I called Microsoft that I wanted an :uk: version instead of the 2 languages that were pre-installed. (1 license key instead of 2 license keys)

Microsoft wanted >100€ for the privilege, so I Googled “Linux Support” and the first hit back then was Ubuntu, so I downloaded that on another computer, burnt it to DVD and installed that.

In 2018 I was sick and tired of snap installs slowing my boot times and DDGed “Linux without snap” and Arch came up as the first hit and something called “Manjaro” came up as second and the rest is history

:crazy_face:

However the first *nix I ever used was something called Xenix and I’ve used AIX, RHL (before is was called RHEL), HP-UX, Tru-64, as a professional *nix admin long before 2012…

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I’ve championed Vivaldi before to use with systems which can handle use of a Chromium browser, with such a functional browser skin. But my question is why only for Cinnamon?

What’s the logic of introducing disparity in supplied browser between desktops?

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I absolutely do use Linux for privacy reasons!
And i was sick of Windows when 10 came to life, so i tried a few distro’s and ended up with Linuxmint which was actually very good.
After a while i get tired of old software, adding PPA’s to get newer ones and slow boot times.
Then came along with Manjaro Cinnamon and love it, it is fast, rolling and has AUR which has almost anything you can think off.

@oberon
So my option would be to get a software part into the installer (for the basics like browser, email etc), The user can choose what they want.
Or remove all propetaire software and let the user install it themselves if they do want it.

offtopic
And the same goes for all the changes to cinnamon theme, i don’t like it all black, So include that in the installer as well, standard cinnamon theme or your adjusted theme?

You definitely can change the theme, and like how I remove Firefox for Vivaldi (since I don’t webdev), you can remove Vivaldi in favour for Firefox.

There’s one consideration to make, however if you are on the fence about whether to trust this browser, beyond the memory issues which may be present as a Chromium fork that uses a custom UI, and that is, as you said, privacy.

Vivaldi, like every other third-party Chrome browse decided to tell Google go FLoC themselves and they provide 2FA for data synchronized between browsers. If you want a password held separate from your vivaldi.net account which also needs to be punched in to decrypt your data, you can have that.

Knowing this, and seeing the development of Vivaldi, they have a solid community which is par and complementary to ours.

I do agree on one thing, and that is choice. manjaro-hello could stand to have a browser choice feature similar to Ubuntu MATE’s welcome software, which literally has a browser selection button, in spite of the fact Wimpy chooses to include Firefox.

Ultimately I hate that Firefox has such low market share these days, but Firefox also just doesn’t have the feature set I was chasing with them through bolt-ons pre-WebExtensions / Quantum, and Vivaldi offers all of the neat tab management stuff I had been after since at least 5.0, with them bridging the gap between the ubiquity of Chrome and the freedom of third-party choice with seemingly boundless functionality.

So yes, I like that Vivaldi comes with this, though Manjaro live images can be smaller if users were allowed to download the browser of their choice within manjaro-hello which would mean faster downloads and the appeasement of everyone, at the expense of excluding something which is useless without an Internet connection.

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I do use vlc, gimp and blender, but when it comes to a distribution installation I prefer to keep that lean. Installing the software I want on my linux system is something I prefer to do myself.

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I read a bit yesterday that Vivaldi is about 95% open source and 5% closed source that is UI. It’s fine for me. Yesterday I tested Vivaldi in VM for the first time, oh that’s good for a workflow, because of page tiling and panel management. Privacy and security are Okay.

I switched Chromium to Vivaldi today. Now I have two browsers: Firefox and Vivaldi. If Firefox doesn’t work then use Vivaldi, even if Vivaldi doesn’t work then Firefox. Why not both?
I know they both have different web tools and drivers.

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We were experimenting on this, but there were problems. The calamares package chooser module was just not very good, and put it into installer makes installation slower, unreliable and requires internet connection. Because of this we moved it to the post installation part. However, this needs to be improved, because nobody is finding it.

Maybe some post-installation pop-up, comparable to Gnome tour, presenting basic selection of softwares (less categories than in Manjaro Hello) such as browsers, office suites, audio/video players.

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Wow, well I’ve been very happy with Firefox - but Vivaldi is pretty special… I love the Hide UI shortcut - whilst I previously wanted an option to hide the URL bar, it also takes away the extension shortcuts… so a complete hide/show UI toggle (now a mouse gesture) is magic.

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The Manjaro hello makes it very simple to install almost anything you want post install. All one needs to do is click the applications button, the first category is browsers, check the box for what you want, and click the update button, and that’s it, whatever you selected will be installed. The less stuff added to the installer the better.

I think this thread is anything but a pros/cons related to features some could be fan of, this is kind offtopic in my opinion.
It’s more related to more high-level paradigms as “open-source matters”, privacy, anti-competitive policy and so on. And also to Manjaro team communication, installation procedure…

Sure, we can debate night and days of each specific feature you like or don’t like, but this is not relevant to me.

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Yes make the post installation part, where u can choose different apps to install, more eye catchy. 90% people just close the Manjaro Hello app. The post installation software installation dialogue box should pop up r8 at the face.

Btw there should b a net install iso. Where everything would b similar to the offline installer except the Default apps, Linux kernel & Gpu driver part (may b even Desktop Environment/Window Manager selection part). These 3 parts should b left 2 the user on the net installer iso/online iso.

This thread is started as an announcement of MJ Cinnamon 21.1.2 shipping browser Vivaldi, nothing else.

You are not ruling this thread, so don’t try to conduct the discussion. :roll_eyes:

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Absolutely! That’s what I love about the EndeavourOS installer. Now that Architect is gone, a netinstaller with select and deselect options would be the perfect solution.

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Yes, I agree

While your English could use some improvement, that is beyond agreement with your points.

A choice of installer with and without an installed web browser would help for people to decide if they want the choice of Firefox made for them, should they need a web browser for accessing local addresses to use with software including web front-ends like File Browser, OpenMediaVault and VLC’s front-end or a faster download with the web tools removed for installation post-initialization which would permit faster initial system setup with the expectation an Internet connection is available afterward for media and Internet browsing tools.

I’ll work on a css modification to make this look more like a gtk4 app with adwaita maia compact dark theme. This is the default theme on Manjaro Gnome.

Completed Tasks

  • create window buttongroup icons

Tasks

  • window buttongroup positioning
  • make top left corner of window rounded
  • resolve issues with inactive window becoming darker instead of lighter
  • create aur package

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Adding to @oberon comment

I like this quote from Arch Wiki

Pragmatism

Arch is a pragmatic distribution rather than an ideological one. The principles here are only useful guidelines. Ultimately, design decisions are made on a case-by-case basis through developer consensus. Evidence-based technical analysis and debate are what matter, not politics or popular opinion.

The large number of packages and build scripts in the various Arch Linux repositories offer free and open source software for those who prefer it, as well as proprietary software packages for those who embrace functionality over ideology. Arch Linux - ArchWiki

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