What may be the best showcases to impress our migrants?

As our tv-channel rbb24 reports: Migration share rose to 34.5 percent in Berlin, Germany.

Of the 1.3 million Berliners with a migrant background, 410,000 come from EU countries, most of them from Poland with 114,000 people. 181,000 people have Turkish roots, 150,000 people Arab roots. 142,000 people have ancestors from countries of the former Soviet Union.

Myself I am married with a tunisian-arabic woman sind 24 years, also.

So I think, this may be a good chance to Linux to show its strong side in supporting as many languages as no other operating system, I think.

I wish to prepare a Laptop as showobject with which I could show Linux at its best.
Therefore I search informations about international projects

What I have found so far are the project arab eyes but I don't know if this is still active, a link to a repository maintained by polish people a adress of a computer dealer in Berlin which sells international keyboars/etikettes, some links to international manjaro sites like manjaro.ru or manjaro.fr.

Please assist, every hint will be welcome.

TIA

P.S. I can only speak german, english and some french so I can not ask the people in their native language.

I am a little confused.. do you mean helpful language-oriented applications?
Or more translations? Or a more complete 'globalist' system that can flawlessly switch between languages? Or just anything that might be helpful at all? Or?..

I'm confuse on why this is in the showcase thread. Sound like a Feature Request. If anything.

So I hope, you will find my following rey of a explanaition more illustrative:

Maybe its hard to you to understand cause you stated you are living on Turtle Island, maybe there does not exist foreign workers or asylants living there with their family for the next decade of years...
You know that there is more than one Turtle Island in the world?

So try to imagine you are arab from syrien, iraq or palastine and living in Berlin now. What would you mostly wish on your Laptop to feel like in your home country?
Applications in your own language, with your own character set. Arabic and russian have no latin characters like we.

Muslims are also obliged to pray five times a day in the direction of mecca, so a prayer times program with spoken azans is most welcome.

What they will love also is kodi wih addons which provide tv channels in their native language for maintain their culture. But I think to discuss about kodi here may be not really welcome in this forum because this has some legal problems.

You get the idea now?

Wouldn't this Laptop not be a showcase tanked with programs and information somebody can show in a showroom but not like in a hall for fine art, instead at computer dealers which wants to sell Laptops tanked with Linux and in neighborhood/community centers or in mosquees?

That is one of the things I thought you meant .. but it was not clear to me.

I think it would be helpful for you to actually create that list of desired programs and functions so that it can be found how to implement them, and so that others can discuss or add to the current list.

For example now we understand one thing you want is pretty simply language. For arabic, farsi, urdu, etc, then there exists a few threads on what packages might be used as well as some workarounds for common issues. Ex:

Otherwise language functionality is already built in - it just may need configuration or language packs. Manjaro Settings Manager is also worth noting here.

As to the next one like prayer times then there are a number of examples in the AUR:
https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/?O=0&SeB=nd&K=islam&outdated=&SB=n&SO=a&PP=50&do_Search=Go

Also this one seems interesting:
https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/elokab-adhan/

Thanks a lot for understanding me!

For now, to name something to begin I have installed Minbar it ofers to play two azans-soundfiles but still have to search the azans to include.

Next I will try the proram mentioned by you.

Do you know this also:
http://www.tucows.com/preview/510930/Prayer-Times-For-PCs-MacWindowsLinux

But the people at https://www.arabeyes.org/الصفحة_الرئيسية offer so much more and I dont know what was happen there cause the last news on their site is from 2017.

Also there is this polish project at Archlinux.

Archbang or Archdeepin may be interesting too.

I will begin to prepare a page like this in the manjaro-wiki:
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/International_communities
This may help at further questions in this direction, right?

Why focusing on making Linux support migrants in western countries, when you already have FOSS available for anyone, anywhere?

  • Linux may have started in the USA, but now you can make and distribute distributions anywhere on the planet. It's not a matter of knowing there are migrants in one's country, but rather that there are many other countries and cultures out there.
  • More than Linux itself, Free and Open Source Software allows to reach everyone since anyone can contribute: providing features, fixing bugs, improving internationalization... And if you don't find an application for doing that, yourself can make it.

At Manjaro's level however, @cscs already made the point.

2 Likes

OT, but it started in finnland: wikipedia
edit: Just realized you might not have had the kernel in mind in which case you were right.

1 Like

Wouldn't it be easier to find out what they are using now? I'm sure there are enough people with these backgrounds living in germany long enough that they speak german. The new immigrants aren't likely to be seeking something new computerwise anyway, the countries they hail from aren't some far far away places where they never even heard of computers now are they

1 Like

Voila, wonderful, you make fun of me!

You are here singing the Song of Songs for FOSS. Gorgeous! :wink:

You're French, right? Since you will definitely like my arguments. Therefore, I hope and ask you to read my contribution to the end.

FOSS, at least from my point of view, is wonderful at first. No longer being enslaved under the rule of the monopolies and having to live with it is, in principle, wonderful and we can and must be eternally grateful to Richard Stallmann and the GNU project for this ingenious invention.

However, this comes to mind first, then we have the Finn Linus Torvalds to thank for the first really functional kernel because, despite the criticisms made in 1992 by Andrew S. Tanenbaum ("LINUX is obsolete "), the author of MINIX, who was sticking to the monolithic kernel, as opposed to the microkernel, which was initially tied to the x86 processor architecture.

However, Linux had a small, fine, but crucial point ahead: It was running !!! :wink:

How long the world had to wait for the long-promised GNU kernel called Hurd and about its actual use and distribution, I need you to tell anything. The GNU people have probably still not managed to develop a usable and accepted by the masses, operating system. I also have to think about gNewSense, the Free Software Foundation-sponsored operating system, which, perhaps the only one, consists entirely of free components and its sad story. Since 2016, no new publication has been made.

In my humble opinion, FOSS is comparable to a bunch of rough gemstones. without an experienced jeweler who is able to work them in the right way, even artistically, not much value.
Of course, anyone could learn the craft, but who does it?

For example, how could anyone drive a single model of a car made for general use, a jeep? In this area, however, I also regard it as ingenious and forward-looking that Pierre-Jules Boulanger, a Frenchman and then director of Citroën, commissioned his constructor in 1934 to design a car:

"Design a car that can accommodate two farmers in boots and a hundredweight potatoes or a keg of wine that is at least 60 km / h fast, consuming only three liters of gas per 100 km, and is able to handle even the worst road conditions so easy to use that even an inexperienced driver can handle it with ease, and it has to be extremely well sprung so that a basket full of eggs will survive a ride over bumpy dirt roads unscathed. " The result was the beloved and widely used Citroën 2CV.

It clearly also requires people who can recognize and formulate needs. In my view, the need of our migrants for an easy-to-use operating system that they can use with their language skills is also a need to be formulated. In my experience, they often do not have the necessary education, the knowledge to be able to put together such a system themselves, as you would for yourself.

Likewise, you could put a lot of people in a kitchen full of appliances and food stuff, something like Paul Bocuse, the French master chef de la cuisine, would did, still could not prepared by them, probably not even the idea to develop.

How can you miss the point so much? :man_facepalming:

Migrants don't come from computer-illiterate countries!
And as such, people from those countries already contribute to FOSS and Linux. Internationalization may be lacking on small projects, but it's already very extended for the biggest ones.

Actually, what really ticks me off is your emphasis on "migrants". Why specifically migrants? Why would the result be any different between a migrant coming to your country and a foreigner in his own?

4 Likes

In fact, we seem to talk miles apart here.
At least in this we are already in agreement.

You are speaking here of the situation, the state of technological development, in their countries of origin and technological cooperation on an international level. There is probably also a good networking recognizable. That may not sound wonderful, but quite good, to.

Possibly, I just say, maybe, I give you the impression of being biased towards the migrants, while you give me the impression that you can not really judge the situation because you may be too far away from it.

May I ask you, when was the last time you in the Parisian banlieues / cités yourself to make your own picture?

In the spring of 2006, the teachers of the Rütli secondary school, in Berlin-Neukölln, wrote an open letter. It was a call to help politicians: language barriers and violence made teaching impossible, the teachers wrote. Intensive offenders would be role models, teachers thrown objects, doors kicked in and fired bangers.

The situation has certainly improved, at least in this school, since then, but it remains to be sure that migrant workers from various countries, especially Turkey or the Arab world, have not already had the best prospects in their home countries. on the local labor markets. Otherwise they would have found a worthwhile job there and could stay there.

In addition, there is the often encountered mentality of the migrants to focus mainly on contacts with their compatriots. In this context, one also speaks of parallel societies.

I am influenced by this practice and of course the migrants that I can meet on the street every day are much closer to me than those who stayed in their home countries.

I do not know if the book: "Germany is getting rid of" by our former Berlin Finance Senator Thilo Sarazziin, has also become internationally known, so much in short: He analyzed the situation of migrants compared to the Germans and culminated In conclusion, Muslim migrants would probably never accomplish much more than fruit and vegetable shops, restaurants, hairdressers and other services, but they would not create much added value.

My wish would be, to come back to it, to provide each needy child the cheapest possible laptop, the $ 100 laptop is probably more reserved for the developing countries, with which it can learn and bring benefits to his parents. With selected programs for this group of people, if possible also in their native language, you could reduce the entry barrier here.

Well, I'm an immigrant to Germany and I don't need any special "Manjaro Immigrant Edition". (What got me to Manjaro was "Manjaro Netbook Edition" - a hardware specific offering.)
My contribution to Manjaro which is specific to my immigration background is that I can help Russian speakers. (I know a bit of Ukrainian, too and a very little bit of Kazakh.)

I would welcome if more people with migration background would be active in Linux. We recently had a shortage on advanced users who would be able to provide a solution for Arabic font problems:


https://forum.manjaro.org/t/arabic-persian-urdu-font-readability-fix/86344/4

2 Likes

So you know about manjaro.ru also and could explain what is going on there?

When I think about the russian language remember to my childhood when I learned to love reading russian fairy tales (perhaps you remember the baba yaga or papa frost also?) at the house of my aunt which lived in the former GDR. As a russian I would love when my distribution shows me a way, like a bridge, where I will find these books, some are already so old that they are free and maybe in the project Gutenberg, so I can find and take one there and tell some of their stories to my little children.

Regardng the arabic font problems:
This depends on what things you want to read. When readin the pages of the arabic wikipedia it helps me to change the font size in Google Chrome from medium to big.
At the website of arabeyes.org they inform also about the Khotot project which aims at increasing the number of available Arabic free and open source fonts.
https://www.arabeyes.org/Khotot

Did you know about these fonts? Do they exist on the AUR?
Could you solve the problem of the requsting user in the end?

No, that's not the business of a distribution. It should only have its documentation available in as many languages as possible.

I don't know anything about Arabic language. What I mean is that we need contributions from advanced users or developers to find an easy to implement technical solution.

They will if you allow them to.
I've met migrants, including Muslims. I graduated high school with some. I know one even got a doctorate in aeronautics. I've also met migrants who came with an engineer degree, but had to work as cleaners because it isn't recognized here.

You say you want to help them. But the way you speak of them is rather condescending. Don't you see the clichés you've spouted so far?

As far as making Linux accessible to them, AFAIK the job is already mostly done, as much as they'd access it from their origin country. And there are people all over the world able to contribute to it.

:gift: https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/?K=arabeyes

1 Like

He will be a great role model. We have a professor for thermodynamics of Turkish origin at my former University. He is a great role model for students of Turkish origin of whom there are a lot of in my town. They tend to study mechanical engineering above average proportion, not so much computer science or electrical and electronic engineerig. (The motivation is to get a good job with a technical degree, but also the fear of presumably more difficult subjects.)

Manjaro has a very active Turkish community. They have their own forum, but many are also active here.

We also have an #arabic tag in #other-languages category. If we get more active users we will open a separate Arabic category.

But I would like to stress that Manjaro tries to be universal to any ethnic or religious group. In front of a computer we all have the same problems regardles of cultural differences: #black-screen, #nvidia, #wifi, #update, etc.

1 Like

Damned translation service at Google translation! Horrible.

What did you don't understand at my last post? Did you interpret, it was my conclusion or that of our previous senator of finance. Mr. Sarazzin here in Berlin? I know they can do bettter when they are allowed, too.

One of my classmates in secondary school, Mouhib El Hussein, a Palestinian, had successfully applied for an apprenticeship at the world-famous Siemens company. Can you imagine what happened? He was forbidden to do this.

From my point of view it was Mr. Sarazzin who was rather condescending, not me.

As far as making Linux accessible to them, AFAIK the job is already mostly done, as much as they'd access it from their origin country. And there are people all over the world able to contribute to it.

But you have never visited the foreigner residences, right? You would find that the families living there can be considered educationally distant, and so long as nobody helps them to overcome it.

By the way: Do you also know that the landlords of these accommodations for foreigners receive so much money per person from the Berlin Senate that the person on the free housing market could finance their own apartment?

So how should a Linux computer ever make its own way into such a family?

Putting manjaro laptops between apple and carrots in a "fruit and vegetable shop" will probably do the trick. :clown_face:

I don't understand why a General Purpose / Desktop distro should focus on peoples that travel from a country to another :expressionless:, what does it mean ? providing good battery life and 4G card support ?

It's school/associations/government/company (mainly those with a human to human contact) role to promote GNU/linux/FLOSS in communities, and not only on western country, in all of them.

Forum kindly sponsored by