Separate video-intel from video-linux in MHWD

mhwd

#1

Currently with nvidia optimus laptops the mhwd nonfree driver defaults to video-hybrid-intel-nvidia-bumblebee, and the free driver defaults to the video-linux catch all, which is specifically video-hybrid-intel-nouveau-prime.

For newer laptops there have been situations recently where both of these options led to a non booting system, both live environments and installed systems not booting (ie cli architect install).

A valid option is to simply use the intel gpu only to get the system booting, but there is no way to install the video-intel driver using mhwd. It has been squashed into the video-linux catch all driver, which is defaulting to nouveau-prime.

Would it be feasible to separate video-intel to its own driver again, currently using mhwd on an optimus laptop it is not possible.

Of course a user could simply not use mhwd at all to achieve this, do it the Arch Way, but that defeats the purpose as mhwd should be used for all driver management in Manjaro.

Thoughts?


#2

SGTM

What was the reason for changing it in the first place?


#3

attempted further idiot-proofing of the distribution most likely


#4

I guess it was for installation media, to boot easily, since there were no problems at the time.
Now there are plenty candidates …


#5

I understand simplifying all the unique PCIID script mangement, but when there are multiple valid open source drivers for a particular graphics setup (ie optimus) this is less than ideal.

It would be nice if video-linux also informed the user of the actual driver installed, instead of users having to deduce it through inxi output, understanding loaded kernel modules and reading xorg config files.


#6

Thats not an option here. If you would only install xf86-video-intel, xorg would simply fall back to it’s modesettings driver for nouveau. It would not disable the Nvidia graphics.

Because that’s what you have in the kernel anyways. Linux shipps all the free drivers enabled. Video-linux now provids the xorg drivers for these kernel modules, so that we don’t have the situation where we would fall back to the modesettings driver(they do not support vaapi or vdpau at all, need in many cases also more power and are not optimized for the hardware they run on).
A split up of them would do no favor for someone. It’s only more to maintain without any benefit.

That’s not possible. Inxi is the tool for this. video-linux is just a installation script to provide xorg drivers for the free graphics stack + vaapi/vdpau and vulkan. The script itself does not know about what is supported by the hardware. That’s kernel level and xorg stuff


#7

No script knows anything, the dev does. Replace script with dev.


#8

You don’t have to use mhwd. Video-intel does not provide setup files or configs. It’s just some kind of meta package for the reason that I don’t want to archive things with mhwd, that are not possible with pacman alone. :slight_smile:


#9

Okay, so basically video-linux relies on kernel and xorg primarily for hardware auto detect and display server auto config.

Thanks for the clarification, although whilst this is easier to develop and maintain it is a less than optimal (and confusing) user experience.

Life for optimus laptop owners will continue to suck I guess, especially with an mhwd setup where both nonfree and free options both don’t boot on either live environment or installed systems OOTB for newer optimus hardware.

Hopefully the optimus-manager package just added to unstable can be improved to be another viable option, at the moment it is stilll pretty hacky.

Just to confirm also … video-hybrid-intel-nvidia-prime has or has not been ruled out as a possible mhwd development addition?


#10

That’s not understandable by me, sorry.

?
All (I guess) mhwd profiles do something, not just install a package. So if there is a video-intel, it would be expected to add something like the minimal Xorg conf. IIRC video-nvidia or bumblebee adds the PCI-id to Xorg conf. A video-intel (assuming a workaround for failing optimus) could disable nvidia and nouveau drivers, so Xorg can use intel or modesetting.
Anyways, I am affected from my programming background, I thought I could make code (auto)do whatever was possible manually.
Maybe M-A which uses bash scripts could do something similar more easily…


#11

As far as Intel-only rigs, an M-A minimal install does O-K, and since MHWD is not part of a minimal install most of the unneeded ‘trash’ doesn’t get installed, either.


#12

M-A uses mhwd to install display drivers afaik.


#13

But does not install itself. :slight_smile:

EDIT: And with nothing in /etc/skel, you aren’t tied to any set profiles.


#14

Huh?

mhwd is a member of the base package group in the core repo, how could it not be installed?

$ qi mhwd
Name            : mhwd
Version         : 0.6.3-1
Description     : Manjaro Linux Hardware Detection library and application
Architecture    : x86_64
URL             : http://git.manjaro.org
Licenses        : GPL
Groups          : base
Provides        : None
Depends On      : hwinfo  mesa  mhwd-db  v86d  pacman
...

:confused:


#15

Hey, mebbe my Wrong! day? :slight_smile:

Then maybe I just thought it wasn’t there since it (apparently?) isn’t enabled in SystemD. Or did I pipe-dream that up, too? :smiley:


#16

Mhwd is just a collection of scripts to install the necessary packages and config files for hardware detected (ie according to PCIID), there is no systemd service assiciated with it afaik.


#17

sometimes we dont want to use intel igpu but video-linux has other gpu driver but it defaults to intel gpu.want to use ati/amd gpu.when using video-linux amd card is not used only intel one is used.
removing video-intel is not possible.
when installing proprietary ati/amd driver
screen turns black and cant get into graphical session.so the dgpu remains unused.
proprietory amd-catalyst is not supported by current xorg.
i found this in archwiki.
so seperating video-intel and video-linux
video-amd/ati also is necessary.for dual graphics igpu+dgpu systems.


#18

I’m just having a old fart day I guess–and I don’t have it installed tonight so I can’t give you the correct names–the kernel, language, and driver detection scripts start services related to themselves. Those services are not started on an M-A minimal (base + base-devel+plasma) installation

P.S. Having a bad fingers day, too. Takes forever to edit… :frowning:


#19

I agree here. I’ve had issues with AMD GPUs, and easy access to driver versions could help with debugging.


#20

It only installs packages, nothing more. That’s not true for Nvidia nonfree drivers, but video-linux.

That’s something we don’t want, because it would mean 3 more things to maintain and test and a lot more ground for bugs to happen, and users with broken setups. If there is an issue with the setup, report it to xorg and or the kernel driver guys. For a proper fix up.