Potential changes to the IRC channel (logging and nick registration)

irc

#1

I’m not sure how much usage people here make of the IRC channel, but I’m in the process of registering Manjaro as a group with Freenode. This gives us much better control over the current IRC channel and all top-level #manjaro* room names.

There are two potential changes that I’d like to run past the community first.

Logging

Currently, all IRC chat is logged to http://echelog.com/?manjaro . This can be useful as reference, but is discouraged in the Freenode channel guidelines.

Question 1: Should we maintain logging?

  • Yes, logging is useful
  • No, we don’t need it/shouldn’t have it

0 voters

Registered-only main channel

#archlinux, among other channels, only allows registered nicks in the channel, and bounce unregistered nicks to a “staging” channel with instructions. This means, for example, moderation is possible (and will reduce spam and other unwanted behaviour), but adds an extra step for new users instead of easily jumping straight onto IRC via a web client.

Question 2: should #manjaro be for registered-nicks only?

  • Yes
  • No

0 voters


To begin with, please keep discussion in this thread about these two points.
We can add other suggestions and discussion once these two points are resolved.


IRC votes:

Three against registration, ambivalent about logging.


Change to #manjaro IRC channel: registered nicks only
#2

#3

I like how Mint does it: after install you click on chat icon and you get automatically properly connected to mint-help and logged in with your computer user name. You can’t make it more convenient than this.

I once wanted to ask quick question in Python chat channel, but I couldn’t do it without registering, two nick-names I tried to use were already taken, and I just said forget it…

I suggest, make it easy, lets not further frustrate potential new users, that are already in some kind of trouble :wink:


#4

Have you been to #manjaro on Freenode in the last half year?
Moderation is something that IS needed in there, and it is way easier to moderate with registered Nicks.

People also has to sign up for a forum account to get help here, so I can’t see why IRC should be the wild west of users, that makes it very hard to moderate.


#5

That’s strange. I was in there and didn’t see any need of moderation.
I wouldn’t like the registered nicks. We already have registration here on the forum. I see the IRC-channel as a fast low barrier way to ask questions and get answers more or less in time without logging.


#6

You hit it a lucky time of the day then.
I stopped visiting daily a couple of months back. Was to much Manjaro bashing going on in the main Manjaro channel, so I just thought: “I’m not getting through to these guys anyway, so why am I trying?” and logged off. Only peeked inside a couple of times since then.


#7

'LLo,

Am i misunderstanding something (no native langage read here !), because at this time, the answers of the two questions sounds a bit contradictory…?


#8

You could say that.

As I see it - without logging - after some time there will be no trace of eg. hate speech even with registered nicks.


#9

The other thing with having a registered nick is that it changes the interaction with the channel. People don’t register an account on the forum just to troll - it’s too much effort, and easy to remove those accounts. While the account is anonymous it’s still your account and that changes most people’s approach.

With IRC, trolls will quite happily use a web gateway or TOR with an anonymous account to spit vitriol all over the place. While it would still be possible to keep registering new nicks, the effort for trolling becomes much greater and it’s much easier to kickban that account. It’s not a “magic bullet” but at least provides basic moderation tools.

With regards logging, we can keep that in place for e.g. #manjaro and point people to #manjaro-talk or #manjaro-offtopic for unlogged discussion. Or, we can leave it as-is and see how it changes just with registered nicks.

We need an active IRC team to deal with this when it occurs rather than having to go back to logs. What help would logs be after a week? But, an “IRC team” is a different discussion.


#10

I think the interests of participating helpers are more important than the interests of new users, because the former group is more scarce.

Logging might help if there are no moderators around who would see a violation immediately. Browsing the logs might help to block a user who got away with a violation.

Registration can be made with low barrier, but the lowest barrier would be elsewhere, Twitter, Facebook. I have the impression that 1-3% of world population know about IRC. (Sorry, for off-topic.)


#11

This is a good point.

@Strit No I haven’t been on Irc, I didn’t know it is that bad


#12

I find that the logging would be most useful to reference bad actors etc. Which is rather superfluous if there is registration. I agree its been rather mucky there at times, so you get a vote for reg, but not for logs.


#13

If I’m reading this right. You guys are ok making #manjaro irc a ghost town?
Sure. My nick is registered to Freenode.net. But for me to get into #manjaro now. Is to be registered again, but this time to a channel??? Is this how going be handle? or Registered nick to freenode.net?
I’m really confuse on this one.


#14

That one. As long as you have registered your nick, you’d be able to access #manjaro.

Of the 200 users on the IRC channel right now, 52 are unregistered. Several are bots or bouncers (e.g. ZNC). Introducing a registration requirement isn’t going to impact regular users, only new users, but then registration isn’t difficult:

/nick mynick
/msg nickserv register apassword name@example.com

#15

Question is not if it difficult. But if the user have time for that?


#16

Why would they not have time? Is a thirty-second process really too long?


#17

I don’t remember it being long. But I did not need to register my nick till the time of hiding. Around Carl left. When that happen. Trolling was really really bad. Took at less two week for the troll to slow down /msg w/e bad thing they felt like. Saying to every user. But again. That was a very long time ago. Rare to troll pop up in the chat. Like once every 3 to 4 month. But again. I think I’m just hanging around the right time.

It not about the time. I’m thinking, if the user really want to be thinking. "Should I join this club? " for the irc.

But ya. Just my option.


#18

I tried to do that Jonathon but I must be doing something wrong or there is something wrong at the moment with freenode. I get this:

Text reappears every 10 seconds when the program is trying to connect again, and again, and …


#19

That looks like an issue with the/a Freenode server. They had issues a couple of days back with their .onion service, so it might be related.


#20

Registration makes sense. I see that the procedure is still the same as 15 years ago and easy enough for everyone. If it helps keeping the idiots out somewhat, then it makes even more sense.

As a former IRC channel admin I’d offer my help, but I won’t be in the channel on a regular basis. And are there really that many idiots in the channel?