Implementation of NVidia PRIME through mhwd

intel
nvidia
mhwd
prime

#1

Currently it is very easy to setup and use Bumblebee on NVidia Optimus enabled notebook systems using mhwd.

Setting up bumblebee through Arch is a bit of a complicated chore, but mhwd abstracts a lot of that complexity within Manjaro, and the result is reliable, stable and easy to setup nvidia hybrid graphics configuration.

Bumblebee always uses the intel gpu by default, and allows switching to the nvidia gpu through optirun and primusrun. There is no option within bumblebee to change the default gpu from intel to nvidia, this is where PRIME comes into its own, by allowing the default gpu to be set to the discrete gpu.

https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PRIME

https://devtalk.nvidia.com/default/topic/957814/prime-and-prime-synchronization/

This can be done manually in Manjaro, but it is a rather complicated procedure. A modification to mhwd to abstract the installation and configuration of PRIME in a similar way to bumblebee abstraction seems like a logical extension to current functionality.

PRIME is the default setup within Ubuntu, and it works very well, would be fantastic to offer this in Manjaro through mhwd.

For example

sudo mhwd -i pci nvidia-prime
sudo mhwd -r pci nvidia-prime
sudo mhwd -i pci nouveau-prime
sudo mhwd -r pci nouveau-prime

There have been a number of threads discussing this recently, for example

Interest and demand for mhwd PRIME functionality is definitely there, so instead of adding to the discussion I think a Feature Request for this extension to mhwd is probably warranted.

If you are also interested in this, like this post, and share your thoughts on Manjaro Nvidia PRIME here.


I'm back. ALmost but I have a question about nvidia-prime
Confusion about dual Nvidia Intel Graphics
#2

You are so hell right.
+1


#3

#4

Thanks for the link.

I am aware that nouveau doesn’t currently work with bumblebee, personally I have never been able to get it to work with nouveau, only the proprietary nvidia driver.

I was of the understanding that Bumblebee != PRIME, so changes to current mhwd bumblebee functionality should not effect or influence potential mhwd PRIME functionality one way or the other. They would be distinct mhwd drivers.

Whether nouveau works with PRIME I suppose would need to be determined, I simply included this potential mhwd PRIME option for the sake of providing an open source driver choice.

In addition to Nvidia Optimus systems, PRIME is also available for AMD Dynamic Switchable Graphics for Radeon systems, according to the Arch wiki link anyway. In addition to the nvidia prime mhwd options, there could potentially be radeon prime mhwd options also.

For example

sudo mhwd -i pci radeon-prime
sudo mhwd -r pci radeon-prime

I don’t know enough about AMD gpus though to add any value to the discussion of the feasibility of this.


#5

I also cant handle my Nvidia 930MX labtop with nouveau. As far as I know Fedora working on a new implemention for hybridcards based on Prime.


#6

Bumblebee has dropped nouveau support end of last year, read the referenced link in the issue.

If we drop bumblebee depend from nouveau mhwd.db, we get what you ask for.


#7

How?

Bumblebee always has intel gpu as the default gpu, you cannot make the nvidia gpu the default gpu, regardless of the nvidia driver used.

My understanding is Bumblebee and PRIME are distinct and different multi gpu system switching solutions. Are you saying they are not, or if one is implemented through mhwd that they other cannot?


#8

Leave that to us.


#9

There are many users enquiring about this functionality, particularly users migrating from Ubuntu to Manjaro, providing a quick conceptual overview of what Manjaro is planning would be helpful and appreciated.

Providing a link to the mhwd source is kind of pointless for users who don’t code, may as well be providing an explanation in Mandarin.


#10

Its the same for intel-ati bumblebee thats needs to be dropped to support mesa PRIME OOTB

But when you drop it, please also finally remove BUSIDs from your xorg setups using mhwd, because for many this still breaks dual and hybrid graphics setups


#11

It lloks to me it fits for a question I have for months, if you can kindly clarify:
I have a motherboard with Intel CPU. It has integrated Intel graffics.
I also have a Nvidia VGA expansion card.
If I install the Nvidia card, does this qualify the bumblebee setup as it is applied for laptops with Intel IDG and Nvidia Secondary?
I hope it 's clear enough :dizzy_face:


#12

I am no communication and marketing guy,
Just saying, I have no time to explain in detail how stuff works on the forum.


#13

Oh FFS nobody is asking for a detailed thesis, just a simple, consise paragraph or two clarification of the general conceptual direction. One minute tops.

If your response to a feature request on the forum is going to be “Leave it to us” and “I don’t do forum explanations” then probably best not to participate in the first place, it adds no value and TBH comes across as kind of elitist and condescending.

Very un-Manjaro like.


#14

If you would have read the link I posted, and the references in there, we could close the case.
I also already answered, yes, we gonna have prime support, the issue I posted is related to your request, as pointed out.
When will we have it implemented? It is not decided yet.

What else to say?


#15

That’s all you had to say.

I assume Prime support for both nvidia and nouveau drivers.


#16

Excellent! :grinning:


#17

Thanks @sueridgepipe bringing this topic to come into question.


#18

We will concentrate on nouveau drivers first. Then we will see. On the AMD side we consider @Tids supporting us with his intel on things.


#19

Given nvidia protect some key gpu features with signed firmware and only release closed source drivers, reverse engineered nouveau drivers generally perform poorly, don’t work with even moderately recent hardware, and can even be dangerous to your hardware for some models.

From an embedded link above

Even worse, your 970m is a GM204 GPU, which means we can’t change the clocks without risking damaging the GPU, because without the signed PMU firmware from nvidia we can’t

  1. change the fan (not important for you)
  1. know if the hardware will shutdown on high temperatures

So for a rather long time you will be better of with the Intel GPU, because there is nothing we can do about it and this isn’t like the normal reasons “we have no time”, but “nvidia screws us over”

Point is anybody using their gpu for anything remotely gpu processing intensive would not use nouveau over nvidia proprietary. The whole point of gpu switching is to increase gpu processing cabailities, which nouveau does not provide.

A much higher priority should be placed on nvidia PRIME over nouveau PRIME. Offloading gpu to nvidia using nouveau often reduces your gpu output, does not enhance it, and for very intensive processing can potentially put your gpu at risk.

If nvidia released decent open source drivers like AMD it would be a different story, but it is not.


#20

With nouveau prime drivers done, any movement on a possible nvidia prime driver?