I really like Manjaro, but: You need to get better at this.

kaos is interesting but it is hardcore qt only. It is one of the distros I maintain a VM for.

Although, I suppose I track a lot of distros that way.

EDIT: I never actually counted those before. I never realized there were over 30 of them.

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:thinking: I genuinely believe Manjaro Linux is for those who people who have an understanding of how Linux works.

Rolling releases do break occasionally.

Also, Manjaro Linux is easy to fix (I know this because I have encountered technical issues on a few occasions and rectified them).

The Manjaro Linux Forum is also filled with solutions; it is a great place to look for whatever technical issue that you are facing with your Manjaro Linux build.

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The way your first post sounded. You should really search and see if you issues have been solved before nagging the Develops and the users who provide most of the solutions before nagging at us.:roll_eyes::roll_eyes::roll_eyes:

@whm1974 Well, that is your opinion, what I should and should not do.

But I am happy to be convinced to the contrary - I will seek technical advice in the tech part of the forum. I am curious, because this is really a hard nut to crack...

If I have to look into something like this. Jumping into live manjaro iso. Then chroot into it. See if you can find something strange with journalctl.
https://wiki.manjaro.org/index.php/Restore_the_GRUB_Bootloader#Use_manjaro-chroot

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I would look here at the the announcements and stable kernel section before doing anything else as someone may have provided the solutions.

Naah, thanks @Days ... it is too late: After a couple of evenings, I give up.
I will reinstall Manjaro for one more try, because I am ... also not keen on going back to Ubuntu :nauseated_face: .
I chroot'ed all week :wink:
The Problem was: Kernel loaded. Initramfs opened ... and it could not start init. It wouldn't. I ruled out: uefi, fstab, gpt partitioning, state of filesystems and grub configuration. The initramfs-cpio seemed okay too. All of it. Tryed different grub implementations.
Debug on kernel gave me that it rolls fine... and then it fails on executing init.
Pointed it to another file, bash, busybox etc, with the init=-kernel param: Nothing. No change even!
Should have pointed it to /bin/true now that i think bout it :thinking:
Also: No dangling symlinks anywhere.
I was here https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/admin-guide/init.rst when I finally gave up.

What can you do, when it is in the cracks between grub boots the kernel but it dies before it switches to root or before it reaches systemd and userland... where you would have logs to go by.

Well, I did not crack that one and I have no idea. Some broken binary in the filesystem that gets packed into the initramfs and breaks the exec of any shell, init or such? That is my guess.

Try to reinstall manjaro kde tomorrow and call it a day now. Good night.

Well If you screwed up in installing Manjaro the first few times, you could simply reinstall the distro again until you get right. Remember to tell the installer which drive to install GRUB. That is a common mistake for folks installing a new distro. Even seasoned veterans do this from time to time.

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As one developer to another - if you really need your system to be stable - don't use an environment which constantly changes and evolves - with new bugs or regressions with requires evolving again.

I know window manager based systems is not in a high regard but they do have a force - they are stable.

I found myself of a stable, predictable environment and I am so happy with it that it became a community edition Openbox and an Arch based version PacBang.

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...the moment of truth, as an end user I will stay rolling. Manjaro xfce is serving me well for more than 5 years now.
But for a project one is working for weeks or months you will not want any changes to the os.

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I agree, stability should have highest priority.
But I think that it already is more or less the case with Manjaro. It tries to give you the (almost) latest bleeding edge packages while trying to keep things in stable conditions. The different branches are a good way of accomplishing this. However sometimes things slip through...

Although there are quite some people on the testing branch of course not every possible hard-/software configuration can be tested thoroughly before it hits stable. The more testers there are, the better things will go for stable.

So I think it's quite hard to find the right balance of delivering the latest packages and having a super stable environment for every system out there. So far the Manjaro team handles it pretty good IMHO.

Actually, since I am using Manjaro (March 2018), I never had to reinstall or ran into a situation where I had to use the live ISO and chroot because of updates (at least I don't remember :wink: ) and I'm even constantly on the testing branch since then. Of course there are hiccups with some packages here and there, but never really a big showstopper so far (knocking on wood).
I must say though, I have pretty common hardware which is probably the major reason I never had big issues. (Maybe I'm just lucky though :slight_smile: )

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That is exactly my experience too. A stable system requires hardware with enough commonality to make the kernel and graphics stable on Linux.

But a stable system also depend on the package sets installed do not experience radical changes.

My personal opinion on the Manjaro ecosystem - and the experience gathered from my community participation tells me that the stable branch has too few updates - so when the branch is finally getting the updates - the chances of some special hard-/software/user config causing a meltdown increases too much.

The unstable branch of Manjaro is often more stable than the stable branch.

Of course the unstable branch carries it's own challenges but they are - in my opinion - easily solved.

As a retired developer I have the habit of requiring a stable predictable system - and I get that on Manjaro unstable - I am in no way reverting to stable - it's just too unstable to me. :laughing:

@postml
Please do yourself the favor of at least trying the Openbox Edition - it has everything you would expect from a full-blown DE plus the stability.

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Yeah, there is always room for improvement...

One particular thing I just thought about is to fast forwards kernel updates to stable also (in terms of patch versions).

For example if you have 5.4.6 in stable, it should probably be updated to 5.4.10.
Usually patch versions do not introduce additional bugs but solve current ones.
Right now stable is deemed to stay on 5.4.6 until the next big stable update is pushed.

@whm1974 I missed some stupid stuff in my time :slight_smile: Including that!

@linux-aarhus Thank you, but I rarly work on that machine at all. I mean, I had a seperate debian stable at some time, on another disk entirely. Or on the laptop.
Now that I am employed, I m provided with hardware anyway. Which is kind of a mixed blessing. Win10. Which is not that bad, I have to admit. Openbox, hm? Hm... Maybe I will have a look, thank you!

@banjo Yeah. I am generally not the Always-the-latest-s***-guy. But I also hate it, when I have an outdated package, that prevents me from doing something. Which is possibly linked to the Human Condition as a whole. :wink:

@moson and @linux-aarhus Yeah! I see Manjaro that way too! Stable enough, Up to date enough! Except for the booting stuff :non-potable_water:
I mean, I know, I said Sabayon always booted, which is true. But, boy, had I a run of stupid errors. I have deleted ".kde" more times than not :wink:

@all Thank you all for your tips and hints! I will definitly have a look at openbox at some point and I will definitly bother you with any problems I have before I take everything apart and crying amidst the debries. :smiley:

One last question: What do you use for comfortably backing up your root system including the boot setup? Except "/home" of course. Like your core, main system incl. /boot and /boot/efi, part-tables, grub etc.
I mean, you boot into another system, say, with a live medium, right? And then dump everything to some third harddisk, preferably with "dd".
I see no other option except employing some kind of enterprise-grade backup solution which I want to avoid. :-/
But how to avoid having like a minimal debian somewhere to make a dump?

Timeshift or Clonezilla

And I think it is time to close the thread.

I think most people here use Timeshift for that purpose. You can take snapshots and put then on an external drive for example. In case you cannot even boot into your environment anymore, you can boot a live medium install timeshift (it might even be included in the manjaro iso already; not sure) and restore your snapshot.

Thank you.
Yes.
See you!

shame they don't have timeshift setup like system restore for windows, which is with the press of a function key you get the windows recovery options including system restore. maybe a future feature for timeshift.

I doubt it because Linux security policies are far stricter, so you would always need to enter your password to open and use Timeshift. The program is also a project maintained by an individual in his free time. With most if not all Linux Desktop environments you can of course assign a shortcut key combination to launch any installed program though. That would get you some of the way to your desired result at least.

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