Gnome 40 Release - Manjaro Timeline

Very unlikely. Software go from Unstable - Testing - Stable when they were enough tested and validated as stable (accidents may happen). Latest version of a python library, it could be quick.

Here, it’s a major release of one of the biggest Desktop Environment. Stable will have it only when it is safer and sufficiently tested/fixed.

Have a look on Unstable Update thread:

Patience is the key.

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Gnome 40 works. No errors
Missing Dash to dock and dash to panel.
.
Please wait…

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They can take their time, go on holidays, visit the world, take a career break, anything really. Then push it to stable in 6 months time. No emergency there. :upside_down_face: :innocent:

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So what is the ETA? Shall we say mid April?

Also how can you upgrade when it hits the testing/staging branches? I might upgrade and try it out if people are saying it’s stable.

Also, I am starting to see more and more extensions being updated, DTD is still not updated but it’s very nice to see.

This has been addressed a few posts earlier in this thread. Basically, it will likely be quite a while before Gnome 40 hits stable. It rolled into unstable today and dropped like a bomb, as expected.

Standard switching between windows (through Activities button) is awful. I wonder, if GNOME developers use it themselves without any extensions. They should dismiss their interface designer. I’m very waiting for dash to dock or dash to panel, because they are must have.

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Use ALT+Tab to switch.

Also, does anyone know why the DTD extension hasn’t been ported yet?

That’s a good question. For the extension maintainer. So ask them. :wink:

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Why is everybody so used to DTD? This is not the concept the Gnome 40 is designed for. We have to see on how it goes.

On our end we have to see which extensions we used on our 21.0 release and how we upgrade our default installations from 3.38 to 40. If that works in a decent way, we may update stable.

Since Gnome 40 apps are mostly still based on GTK3, except chess, they would work just fine with 3.38 shell. This we have to see, as we shouldn’t hold back any updates to our stable branch cos of Gnome 40.

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Why?
Well, it’s a typical contradiction between design and pragmatism of use.
Gnome is backed financially in huge majority by Red Hat, which is an IT and dev-oriented company, with Fedora users being dev-oriented as well for a good proportion. Gnome design is pushed by developers for their developers use case, instead of being pulled by users feedback to accommodate their non-geek work- or entertain- flows.
Not every one is a nerd or geek, not everyone keeps his hands on the keyboard at all times. Non-geeks tend to use the mouse and rest the other hand. Gnome is keyboard-centric, for devs, and not user-centric (mouse-friendly).
So what happens is that some distros have a more mainsteam user base (Ubuntu or Manjaro, probably 15-20x more users than Fedora between them) that have other use cases and other ways to fulfill them. It is difficult with the rigidity of Gnome-Shell to satisfy the variety of those use cases since it was designed as a single version of the truth, a one size fits all, and only few options to diverge from that.

Now, beyond the context…

  • I don’t think (e.g. Ubuntu…) users use the overview or worskpaces much or at all, but they use the dock for favorite and opened windows and the app grid to launch non-favourite apps (non-pinned in Ubuntu Dock/Dash-to-dock).
  • Having a view on which apps and how many instances of the apps are open at all times is an important visual cue
  • Easier to handle minimize windows with a dock and unclutter your active windows of overlapping inactive windows in the background (how many times did I click on the inactive window behind because it was white on white or black on black and I didn’t see the border in between)
  • If you use a mouse, going for the overview or the app grid versus an icon in the dock (for click or scroll) takes the same time, but you don’t have extra steps with the dock once you’ve done that, while you still have more gestures with the overview
  • When not having your hands on the keyboard (like most non-geek), by the time you reach for super with your left hand, I’ve already launched an app or changed the active window (if already open) with the mouse since…
  • Opened windows (via their icons) on Dash-to-dock for pinned apps or opened apps have a fixed location, you know exactly where to reach for
  • While in the overview, you never know where the window will be, you need to look for it, it takes a reaction time to capture the information, like braking when you drive and see an obstacle.
  • In the overview, if you’re full keyboard, you’ll have to go for a 2nd shortcut if you have 10 windows open to get to it or to skip 1-2-5-10 to reach it.

For some, the overview is a distraction from being productive and it gets in the way. For hardcore Gnome fans, it’s the other way around. Problem is, the latter try to impose that unilateral view and their specific use cases to everyone.
That’s why you have Dash-to-dock. To go through the grass in a park because the detour of the alley designed by the architect slows them down from the straight line they could go for. Pragmatism.

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I used to use DTD and some other extensions, but eventually decided to try to get used to using ut with no “theming” and zero extensions. Once I gave it a chance it was pretty amazing! The only thing I would change is the way right-click functions by default, but even that is not a big issue.

I think it’s kind if funny how people try to force Gnome to work differently to the way it was intended and get upset when their “hacks” stop working. It’s almost like the equivalent of a glitch being fixed by a patch in a game.

After I got used to vanilla Gnome I decided to try this approach with software in general. Their is a reason developers make certain decisions I believe, maybe to keep a cohesive design as intended by their philosophy
Changing their decisions breaks that.

Unpopular opinion: If people REALLY need these extensions then they should fork Gnome or use a Gnome-derived DE like XFCE or Pantheon. If they still want to use official Gnome then they’re on their own when/if these hacks stop working - it has nothing to do with the Gnome team, otherwise it would be a part of Gnome by default.

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Read KDE :grin::grin::grin::grin::grin:

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Or use Gnome on a fixed release distro. For instance, I use Gnome on Fedora, and I only do an in-place upgrade to the next Fedora release only when the latter release is at least 3 months into its existence. That way, the basic extensions that I use (DTD, ArcMenu, mpris indicator button) should have updated to work with the newer Gnome by then.

PS. I also use Gnome on Anarchy (arch-based), so whenever there is a big Gnome upgrade, I hold off updating the distro for about 2 weeks. If some extensions still don’t work with the latest Gnome when I finally update, I bear with it until the extensions are finally ready. Since I have so many other distros I can use on my machine, it doesn’t hit me that badly.

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I’m considering using Fedora as my next daily driver… they’ve been doing a lot of great work these past years.

So, what you’re saying is:
“Someone designed something for themselves, but they know better than myself how I should handle my workflow in all its diversity, so I will hand them over all the power to decide for me how I should do it and just comply”.
I don’t know you and by what I’m gonna say I don’t mean to judge or be rude but (on the principle itself and only that) this seems like you would be a good subject for a dictatorship, or a good soldier.

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I don’t know you and by what I’m gonna say I don’t mean to judge or be rude but (on the principle itself and only that) this seems like you would be a good subject for a dictatorship, or a good soldier.

Well you would be terribly wrong, but that’s alright :slight_smile:

I choose to use it with minimal changes after having used it with extensions earlier. You’re free to do as you wish, I’m just being honest about my own experiences. Have you given it a chance of say a few weeks/month without any extensions just to see what it’s actually like when you’re used to it? Might save you time and frustration in the long run.

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I’m surprised how smoothly the upgrade in “unstable” went. Everything (except, naturally, most extensions) just works. I found no serious issues and especially enjoy the small quality-of-life improvements made to “The File Manager Formerly Known as Nautilus”.

I previously used Dash to Panel and I’m ambivalent about the improved workflow in Gnome 40 without DtP. It’s pretty, it’s smooth, there’s certainly a good amount of logic and thought behind it. But it’s also giving me a bit of an unwanted work-out: simple things like task switching just require so much more mouse travel or clicks unless using keyboard shortcuts.

It feels a little bit more multimonitor-monitor friendly than Gnome 3.x for the sole reason that the dash is no longer on the left, but the whole workflow is still very much build around a single screen.

I’m sure I could get used to this, but I’m still not sure if I want to.

Very godd arguments!
[irony on]
How many normopaths use microsoft-only programms in Wind**fs
and even think they are not allowed to use different sources…
Satisfied with the original half-baked stuff…
[irony off]

:innocent:

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This is LINUX - does anyone of the arguers know what the intention / motivation of Linux is???

Oh God - (could not resist) - welcome to the Community.