and yet most of the people here in this topic want to change the teams decision. --> Spoiled brats.
I haven’t asked asked them to change anything. I gave my feedback that I thought restoring certain forums was a good Idea and was met with “if you don’t like it try another distro” and most people have been met with the same hostility from the team. I’d hardly call that demanding anything for behaving like a spoilt brat. Behaving like a spoilt brat would be demanding things change or I’m leaving which pretty much isn’t the case it’s the opposite
Well, in the end a decision shall be made.
And it never happened to me that in any project I have seen through the years trying to fit to everyone’s wishes has worked out. You end with a mess.
Which isn’t to say you shall be an ace about it, but I don’t feel it’s the case.
You shall decide what is the true essential, and be willing to leave out the rest.
I have never been hostile in this community. But if brought it up or projecting it, let me ask you, how can i be hostile when i did all this in the old forum:
Is all i have left from old forum and not to boost my ego, but to clarify:
Haw can i be hostile and welcoming in the same time ? Can we be sure you are not projecting something here? I’m appealing to a clear objective consideration, nor whatever subjective opinion. Do you know me, or do you think you know me? Doing this sort of intellectual autopsy one me here, is not something i treat slightly, but that doesn’t mean i’m hostile.
So, once again, how was calling them
better? Are they opened tumors? Is Manjaro a bleeding animal or something?
Does require empathy to do this kind of work or not?
If not, then probably you are right. If does, then how much more do i miss of having to not be taken as hostile by people in this conversation?
And it never happened to me, ever, that by giving tons of explanation anyone changed their mind.
You are correct amigo, but, i prefer things on the table from the start, so we do not make mistakes in the open anymore.
I’m sorry, but the headline is “Wanting a catch-all.” With several speakers it’s hard to know who’s asking what…
personally I don’t even remember the topics in the free category … music, humor? in any case nothing really important and especially nothing that should make us leave this forum if we think a little.
If one or 2 topics were important then yes, the community should ask for those topics but certainly not a FB number 2.
The choice of metaphor another Manjaro user utilises isn’t the point here, is it? How @jabber or pretty much any other regular joe-schmoe forum member communicates has little to do with my end-user experience. When there’s a ‘Team Badge’ involved it’s a bit different. If I walk into a shop operated by my internet provider, it’s the behaviour of the people with the name tags that matters, not some random passer-by.
Though I’m not sure what the connection between your main profession and your role as a Manjaro Team member are, I’ll bite: most successful caricaturists possess biting wit and the ability to zero in on their subject’s flaws (physical or otherwise) so that they can emphasise these for comedic effect, almost the opposite of empathy in a way.
I would absolutely put my money where my mouth and pay for Manjaro, once off or on a running basis (as I used to in donating) - especially since I now have to use it for work. Paying for Manjaro would mean the people dealing with feedback and support issues are compensated financially and we don’t have a situation where they feel under appreciated. Users can then also express their honest concerns and issues with the product without feeling guilty for how much time somebody voluntarily gives to the community.
It seems like people here forget that all of Manjaro’s decisions are made by a team. None of the people on the team are paid (ok apart from the two you already know), so the majority of the team “works” in Manjaro for passion, fun and because they like what Manjaro is. Many in the team have just joined and maybe I can consider myself one of the veterans of the team (maybe I have been a part of it since 2012? I don’t remember well) so I can speak with enough reasons of fact. None of us have a muzzle in our mouth, any of us can express their opinion or opposition. In the past there may have been unpleasant decisions or forcing, but there has always been discussion about what was best for Manjaro OS (yes the operating system). Those who disagree can always leave Manjaro but I’ll tell you one thing: the latest vicissitudes within the team have strengthened our team bond and the forum you see is proof of this. Please use Manjaro for what it is: an OS and let the social networks do their job …
Long life and prosperity
I think if other members of the team had replied with comments as polite and well constructed as yours then the thread wouldn’t have descended into what it became
No one in the team is native English speakers but English should be used as a universal language when you want to talk to many people. It is a standard. The fact that I was able to express opinions politely is perhaps just luck. Perhaps concepts translated into English but not thought of in the English language can be misunderstood. In Italy we have ways of saying that maybe translated into English they sound bad and so for other languages. Let’s not dwell too much on the words themselves but on what the concept should represent.
You pay them based on a contract and that is their job.
Do you go and acuse a community volunteer policeman for being hostile wen comes to mediate reasonable a public meeting? Why, because is wearing a badge? I can ask to have mine removed if intimidates you.
And how would be exactly your business? Did you ask the people from your internet provider about their relationship there too? I’m sure they gave you the keys to their house to go checking.
Ah, so you are a caricature expert. Then let me clarify it. Emphasis is not demonizing, demonizing would be lack of empathy. I was demonized here, not once, not twice, but countless times already. I’m sure you didn’t noticed that.
Appreciated any support for the community, but if you go back and read my statement in the old forum, i don’t and i will not get donation money. My involvement in the forum and parts of the project was because i can’t donate money.
If i was to donate my kidney to someone, i would not go chasing that person around, to see what they drink, what they eat as if now i own them. Hope that will sink in.
All the official announcements regarding the decisions about new forum, and all the comments that came from the @Manjaro-Team and @moderators are polite, is in our Forum Rules. so why would we break them?
Do we reply strong? Yes, but still polite.
Continuing to project that was not polite, and insisting on it, will in the end lead to something that nobody here wants, so, step back and read again, and please read in the context. Applying your internal voice to the text written by others will mislead you badly. Consider that too!
If and only if, patience would have been a general atribute of everyone, the risen questions would have been answered better.
We had the patience to try to recover old forum. We had the patience to build a new one when the previous task failed. We had the patience to leave all our other projects and only deal with this, so the community gets the status of ALIVE back. We had the patience to answer in general or in particular to all, only to get that we are not welcoming enough, but we are hostile.
What a wonderful outcome!
But you know what? We still have the patience and courtesy to deal with them! FIRMLY
Since both sides in this are seemingly not open to compromise anymore, I view this as a senseless waste of time at this point and the thread could be closed as it serves no longer any purpose. It would be hard to even call it a discussion at this point, disappointment or exchange of word-shivs would likely be more appropriate.
Do you? With the new account creation he could be an impostor.
Well, you could be like a villain’s henchman who is very wellcoming to the victims whom he lure to his master’s lair just because he knows that they will suffer there and therefore being secretly hostile. What an image.
Anyway, I would like to clear some confusion I have with the present forum. I do not claim it is now good or bad just that the “new vibe” was not exactly explained what it should look like (or rather I am a little bit slow ).
Previously, the forum for me was “one place to go” if I wanted something with the OS. I was able to get a technical feedback, share some of my bash scripts, or conky setup and also see some other people’s creation. It would not be classified now as something worth “contribution” category but it gave me a good inspiration what I can do with Manjaro OS.
My expectation is that people here will suddenly lose any interest in showing off their creation that is worth only some “bragging right”.
I expect you had some discussion withing the Manjaro team when you structured this new forum and I would like to know what is a prefered approach if I want to just show off my modification of a stock Manjaro desktop or just to share/read some minor news from the world of linux (you know the needless chit-chat).
Is the current stance like “just go to reddit” or something like that? Just a confused person here.
The question though is who this “we” is. I suspect that many of the old members hung out because the forum was interesting and lively, and then helped out while they were here.
If it gets less interesting, you might see fewer members visiting the forum just to help out.
The decision to cut out the Screenshots thread in particular, surprised me and not in a good way.
If it were an issue of storage, just restrict image sizes and require the full image to be hosted on image hosting sites. Or restrict it just to Manjaro screenshots only. No more screenies of other distros. I think completely excluding it is a mistake.
May I please add this definition and see if anyone agrees?
a feeling of fellowship with others, as a result of sharing common attitudes, interests, and goals.
Now I’m not saying manjaro IS another distro or has to follow with other distros, but
Obviously other people feel that chat is important to build fellowship with others… Just putting it out there…
By the way, you guys are making every case to REMOVE the general discussion tab completely even if it’s only available to TL3.
Please keep any further discussion civil. I dislike hostile environments. They don’t get much done. Thanks .
As I said, I’d be willing to pay for support, if it came down to it. It’s probably fairer on both parties.
This is a bit silly, by saying “I’m not sure what the connection between your main profession and your role as a Manjaro Team member are” I just meant you’re going off topic, I’m not looking for your bank statements or personal details. You voluntarily linking to your Instagram account is hardly me going through your bins or spying on you from across the street.
I agree with @Takei, this should thread should probably just be closed. If it makes a difference, how this discussion went has convinced me that the forum probably doesn’t need an ‘Off Topic’ or ‘General Discussion’ forum. This isn’t enjoyable in the least.
I am not interested in standing in the way of the Manjaro team shaping the project as they see fit. I will just have to evaluate for myself if I want to use the end result down the line. It could be amazing for all I know.
Are YOU an impostor?
You are in the making of a psychological fiction book, with a lot of complex scenarios … the villain dies at the end. Ok, i get it. Have you tried to contact DarkHorse or DC Commics? Always good stories can be published.
No, we never speak among them members. All is randomly chaotic.
The @Manjaro-Team - how many times this needs to be answered? We are a team that we bring forth something for the community. The focus is Manjaro OS. We don’t want chit-chat, nor to deal with it.
No mention about
RESPONSIBILITY sharing. Did you noticed?
Your concern was off topic and out of place to mention.
Kindly appreciate the feedback so far as we always consider it, we do care about community!